Straightening Bent Detail

[up148]

Recently acquired a C&LS 4-10-2 and upon unpacking noticed one of the marker lights is bent out of plumb. Actually, both were bent, but the fireman's side was only slight and I was able to straighten it with finger pressure. But, these are the firmest mounted marker lights I've ever encountered and even the one slightly bent required almost all the strength I could logically apply before it yielded (bless you Henry, this is one of he stoutest models I've own). I was sure it was going to pop off in my hand and I can tell I was incredibly close to an "Oh Sh*t" moment.

So, the other one is out of plumb more (maybe 10-15%) and I'm wondering if there is another method. Would applying heat (maybe a hot air heat gun since the model is nicely painted) to this detail make the brass more pliable with less chance of snapping it off? I've only snapped off a few details in my decades of modeling and I don't care to experience that emotion with this model.

I guess the real question is will moderate heat soften the brass ML mount enough to allow me to massage the marker back to plumb or does it require so much heat that I risk damaging the paint?

Any and all comments appreciated.

BH

[Jay Criswell]

Butch,

My first thought would be no. My rationale, to get it hot enough to anneal the part would require far more the than the surrounding solder could handle. Good chance it will fall off in the process. My second thought, yeah maybe. Using a resistance soldering machine might allow you to apply enough heat, very quickly, to accomplish your goal. The cool thing about the paint they're using these days is it ability to withstand the heat required. My third thought, better to have it come loose rather than break.

Like so many of these opportunities, it's the setup and prep that takes all the time and effort. Having said that, take your time and think it through.

Last thought, hell it ain't my model......go for it

Good luck,

Jay

[E7]

Jay has probably forgot more about this stuff than I know, so take it that I am NOT disagreeing with anything he said! With that advisory, you might try using a heat gun. Might be a bit easier to control the temp.

Apart from that, maybe using something like an "orange stick"

https://www.grainger.com/product/22KY16 ... 06134402:s

as a pry to work it back into place, or maybe pliers/needle nose with padded jaws.

Good luck!

Rich

[Jay Criswell]

Rich,

Maybe but keep in mind, I've forgotten a lot of stuff!!

Jay

[up148]

Appreciate the comments. I plan on waiting until maybe a miracle solution pops up or something I have the courage to try it. The reason for the heat gun was twofold. More controllable heat and don't need to touch the part with a hot soldering iron or resistance soldering probe that requires a clean (paint free) surface to generate its heat. The padded jaw pliers is a solution, but harder to "feel" the force you're using. Have some time to listen and think about it, so we'll see what turns up.

BH

[bob turner]

If it is that tough, one has to wonder how it got bent? Most brass can handle two bends, but there are alloys that cannot survive even one. The annealing process involves going to red heat, then water-cooling - do not bend while hot. The problem is, almost any solder is long gone by the time brass gets red, and once annealed it is dead -soft, ready to move again if you look at it crosswise.

Maybe the heat gun can't hurt. But you bent one back successfully.

[bob turner]

I remember a story when I worked at Dripcut. Those syrup dispenser handles were diecast straight, and then had to be bent to that hand-fitting curve. The engineers tried everything to bend that curve. The only thing that worked without breaking the diecast alloy was a sudden impact. Wham!

You can see that when you drop a Lionel locomotive - the cab will bend. I have no idea how one straightens bent die cast.

[Jay Criswell]

Not sure how a heat gun would be able to concentrate the heat to a small enough area to do any good. The other issue with a heat gun, you get it hot enough to soften the brass (anneal it) all the surrounding solder has long since softened to the point where parts are falling off. You need to concentrate the heat into a very small area.

In my mind, a the tweezers on a resistance solder machine would be your best bet. Without actually having the model in front of me it's really hard to say but you might be able to pinch the tool so the ends touch each other (with the offending part sandwiched between), and fire it up. If placed right where you want to make your bend it might work. No paint would have to be removed. Like Bob says though, you get it annealed it's going to be dead soft and very easy to bend again. Left untouched that probably would not be a problem.

Actually, thinking back I had to do the same thing on sister model (can't remember if it was mine or belonged to someone else) but it had broken. Once it broke paint was the least of our issues. Wonder now if there was an issue with the factory packaging creating this issue.

Jay

[E7]

I would guess that the damage occurred during shipping....probably due to the engine not being immobilized inside the packaging. The stuff Henry did with Boo Rim was always VERY well packaged. The 4-10-2 was after Henry's fallout with Sae Ho, and done by LIK, and I never saw their packaging. Knowing Henry, I am guessing it had to be decent. The bugaboo here is, it was the second time around, so maybe original packing was NOT used. I'm sure Butch could tell us.

I'm speculating here, but thinking the best candidate for doing the bending (assuming NO heat used) might prove to be a younger female, who likely has a "finer" touch. Sort of like the movie, only call it "No Bending For Old Men" .....and yes, I include myself in that grouping.

Rich

[bob turner]

Can you get an impact on it? Like with a nailset and small hammer?

I am with Jay. My only experience with heat guns is low temp stuff - I agree, any heat gun that could melt solder is way too hot.

[Robert]

A good clear photo would help the thinkers formulate a method perhaps.

Robert

[E7]

Can you get an impact on it? Like with a nailset and small hammer?

I am with Jay. My only experience with heat guns is low temp stuff - I agree, any heat gun that could melt solder is way too hot.

A bit of clarification: I wasn't advocating temps high enough to melt solder. I think the answer is physical force/pressure/twisting. (opinion) Things move more readily the warmer they are, which is the purpose of the heat. The old story ala automotive collision work is you are trying to apply an equal force in the exact opposite direction. Easy to say, hard to do.

Using a nail set and a hammer will likely mark the paint. I think I would go after it with needle nose pliers with some kind of pads glued on the jaws (thin leather maybe?) Maybe better yet: duck bill pliers which are usually smooth jawed. (I would still opt for padding the jaws.)

[Robert]

I was curious to see exactly what model was being discussed. I found an example online at Brass Trains.com. I studied all the excellent photos at length. It is beyond an exceptional piece of craftsmanship...ultra impressive.

The marker lamps do appear to be readily accessible verses being buried away beneath layers of other details. I'm betting some careful slow and steady force applied to it will yield success. Worst case it breaks off and then one of the hobbies real craftsman can certainly make a like new repair to it.

It's a beauty Butch.

Robert

[bob turner]

Without study, may I assert that this model is the zenith of O Scale imports? Beyond even KTM USA?

[E7]

Without study, may I assert that this model is the zenith of O Scale imports? Beyond even KTM USA?

Which brings to mind this question: Henry identified the builder as LIK Enterprises.....I have not heard of them since. Considering the acclaim this model has received one would think other importers might have used them.

Then again, considering the overall excellence of Henry's output, maybe it was his guiding hand that was ultimately responsible for the results!

RIP, my friend!