Doorstop four axle Diesels

[Dennis Holler]

Oh yeah, I got these castings from Arthur out of OKC. I found some info on the prototype... Any thoughts on who might have made these back in the day? Kind a rough..




Did not get a chassis with it, just the walls and roof. But hey, I've never seen a model of one so I figured a fool and his money you know...
It is GEIR, after Alco left the consortium I guess in 1928 or so. Art did send some side frames with it so hopefully with a little straightening and filing etc I can get it to fit together.

[bob turner]

Bump. Jim and I are looking at the H20-44 Fairbanks Morse, as done by Baldwin or Walthers or somebody. I have had the opportunity to acquire one of these on several occasions, but always felt the model not worthy of much attention.

But thinking about it - there is a more or less ok kit laying about - perhaps something can be done?





These are CLW, done by the inimitable John Fisher. But here is the original:



There is another one of these in a thread somewhere. I will look for it. What I want to point out is the cab variation.

[bob turner]

Yeah - here it is:



Moving one of John's photos down to this post:

[bob turner]

I am going to suggest that John took the casting, separated the cab, reduced the "Lowey" angle (you can see less space between the cab bulkhead and that first screen), and lopped off a quarter inch of the rear cab, re-locating the bulkhead to reduce the width of that hideous window. It appears he re-did the window, which is a really great idea, for both this and the H16-44 of the same lineage.

If you study the photos immediately above, you can see where the cab bulkhead intercepts the truck sideframe, if you drop an imaginary line from various places on the slant bulkhead.

So we may attempt something like that - I am proposing a straight-side cab, no Loewy slant, and no Loewy window - the decision as to whether the back of the cab has rounded edges or not remains for later.

Wheelbases are somewhat nebulous - the H10-44 and H12-44 have 25.5 foot between centers, and we are not sure yet what the H20-44 is. Truck sideframes might also be problematic, but our secret weapon is Stevenson, who has always been willing to make a few castings for us.

The really nice Kemtron RS truck is 9'3" wheelbase. I have some sand castings with roller bearing caps that scale out to closer to 9'7". One Fairbanks Morse drawing shows an 8' wheelbase, but the drawing shows the EMD switcher truck, as used on the SP. So it appears that we can do what we want and still remain more or less faithful to the prototype - which may wind up being green, red, and yellow P&WV.

[De Bruin]

I did not notice that UP H20-44 had a modified cab until your post, very impressive work indeed.
Just a note I believe all of the H20-44's had the earlier GE factory AAR B's, the FM's version of the B truck found on later H15-44's, H16-44's and the C-Liner-verse had that distinctive curved equalizer version which was accurately (opinion) rendered in plastic by AHM.
Jim has posted a H20-44 in IHB here that is my favorite paint scheme wise example of the lot, though if you were to "extrude" one of those P&WV factory scheme's that would be hard to beat. BTW, in all of the color photos of these and their H16-44's the hoods on these were black not dark green.
https://www.rr-fallenflags.org/pwv/pwv54ggC.jpg
https://www.rr-fallenflags.org/pwv/pwv90l14.jpg

[R.K. Maroon]

The existence of two cast-bronze O-scale versions of the FM H20-44 is one of those oddities of the hobby, whereby two different manufacturers offer models of the same (relatively obscure) locomotive while leaving more common prototypes unmodeled. In this case, both CLW and Baldwin offered the H20-44. Not many of the prototypes were sold and not many railroads had them, so in retrospect it wasn't all that great a choice. Unlike the Alexander and Icken version of the New Haven EY-3 switcher, which share the same casting set, the CLW and Baldwin H20-44 are of different designs and have no common parts. Here is a diagram of the CLW version found in the assembly instructions:


https://dl.dropbox.com/scl/fi/qmblsojmrkt0f66z7ba3b/CLW-FM-H20-44-Kit-Drawing-Crop.jpg?rlkey=9ixrrwi5xmge7ykvi8r0q5fet

Note that the shell is a single casting with integral walkways and end platforms. On the Baldwin, the walkways and end platforms are part of the "floor", which is a separate piece:


https://dl.dropbox.com/scl/fi/di3dusg2zva4pkviy1e4x/Baldwin-H20-44.jpg?rlkey=kuaajguvajqkycehme2cghh3e

Neither version has a very accurate cab. The Baldwin is the worse offender in this regard, as the cab has been stretched to accommodate a vertical universal motor:


https://dl.dropbox.com/scl/fi/zkmc9dyuw0gjg1dd45ity/Baldwin-PRR-FM-H20-44-06.JPG?rlkey=kqlok4itu248rp34o81fvt928

My guess is that Baldwin stretched out the side windows on the cab to accommodate the longer cab -- UGH.

The CLW model has a very early version of what became their standard drive. This is notable for the presence of a gearbox on every axle:


https://dl.dropbox.com/scl/fi/vgc2k5ahvsx9xxkihg6ne/CLW-FM-H20-44-IHB-6789_02-Crop.jpg?rlkey=wnotxk1z1t3ve029p82utkh8u

The slightly larger gearbox on the left has an integral gear tower, which is driven by a horizontally-mounted motor in the cab. The motor is a tight fit to the cab. This allows the cab to be closer to the correct size:


https://dl.dropbox.com/scl/fi/eo4ecklk79hq2a59a6ep0/CLW-FM-H20-44-IHB-6789_03.jpg?rlkey=l5xjaltlyfrehqaiv9dbd96ug

Historical records indicate that the patterns for the Baldwin were done by Oliver Haines and the castings came from Brown Bros Foundry in Stamford, Connecticut. The CLW patterns were created by Bob Smith and Lindsey Adams and the casting were by Adams and Son in Wichita, KS.

Jim

[up148]

Very interesting on stretching the cab and adding windows. Artistic license and a tradition the Japanese and Korean's continued with the brass models they built. They got better at hiding compromises.

[Carey Williams]

Sorry to be late to the party ..referring to the FT diesels ..perhaps by Jack Collier

Jack did offer a casting kit for a CP Huntington little steamer in 1947....

The Collier GG1 ...in HO & O gauge ...the nose just is not right ...but good effort ....at $250 for a RTR model that was full freight pricing .

Collier was very active with the Eastbay Model Railway Club ...is store in Oakland was very small ...narrow and long

Link to see the Collier O gauge GG1

https://youtu.be/sQoYhlH-08M?si=s1TFXUw19KPc-nEZ


Link to see Collier HO GG1
https://youtu.be/oVCKryhxbCA

Cheers Carey Williams

[bob turner]

Jim sent the above castings the other day. I just sliced the front bulkhead out of the casting on both sides, folded two chunks of 1/16" thick brass to fit, and soldered the whole mess together. I am off to the bead-blaster, then final priming and finishing. Look for a photo in a day or so. We think it looks better already - I have turned down freebies on these things several times because of that cab, but like the CLW PA nose, castings can, with effort, be modified.

[bob turner]

Done. Jim is going to add the grillework, straighten the hand rails, and power the thing. As of right now, it looks like it will be P&WV.

As above, I added metal on the sides and forward cab bulkhead, and in the window area - all 1/16 brass, held with lots of solder. Then to cover the slight blemishes, I used auto glazing putty - never more than about .010, which is less than a 64th.

I think it transforms a truly ugly model. There is a remote possibility that I would do one for me - SP Tiger Stripe. I gotta tell you, the castings would have to be free.

[bob turner]

A pair of Sharks! Thanks, Jim.



This time all the wheels are on the track, but the journal slipped out of the sideframe on that front truck. Temporary repair was a pair of wires over the drop equalizer. Further research is necessary, since they are not held together with screws.

Note that the truck sideframes are larger on the lead unit - the rear unit has Kemtrons. I think the lead is CLW.

An AA set of Sharks is necessary for any self-respecting SPF.

[R.K. Maroon]

They look good together, Bob. Glad my lone single unit found and running buddy. I believe you are correct that unit 2004 has CLW trucks. Here are a couple of underside shots:


https://dl.dropbox.com/scl/fi/0dy0qlwmiyxwhqrlgzjb6/Penn-Erie-Shark-PRR-2004_05.JPG?rlkey=cnytdk6jabeiw8emu9p74a209


https://dl.dropbox.com/scl/fi/b3cb6qyq0eropdiwu9qsr/Penn-Erie-Shark-PRR-2004_06.jpg?rlkey=gujia829kvornjljlwlgy60a0

[bob turner]

See those two prongs that jut "up" from the leaf spring casting? I scraped the paint off the very top and soldered on a very wide "C" channel, to hold the bottom of the side frames together. I have another pair like these, where someone soldered a crossmember between the two drop equalizer bars. Apparently, splaying is a common trait for these relatively nice looking trucks.

After bending those really heavy duty cotter pins and tightening the bolster attach nuts, the thing ran pretty good. Its next owner should disassemble all gearboxes and put some Teflon grease in there.

I like the Brunswick - never cared for the stock Scale Craft Brunswick, which was simply black with a hint of something. I always stuck a small amount of CNW green in the Scale Coat, but mine is still a shade darker than this one. Floquil was probably too green.

[bob turner]

On the CLW trucks - I had a pair stashed away with ancient All Nation transmissions. Somebody had soldered wires under the equalizers to hold the side frames vertical, but it was not enough.

I popped the C-clips, gently squeezed the bolster in a vice, and re-assembled using my new lower bolster technique. Who knows - maybe I will actually power something with them.

I am not going to bother sticking a photo in Shutterfly, but if somehow I can get the forum software to accept a shot I will stick it here:

Nope - not working. Even dragging and dropping is out. Photo was not good enough for me to waste Shutterfly space.

[sarge]

Bob:

If you pop them apart again, shave the face of the bolster where it meets the sideframe, then reassemble with a thin washer between the circlip and the back of the bolster; you can narrow them pretty readily.

One of those red fibre washers that Kadee sell in packet lots placed over the axle end on the insulated side can't go amiss in keeping the insulated wheel from touching the sideframe, either, once you power it.